“A friend of mine found this blog and told me to read the post”

Puh-leeze. You were Googling yourself, weren’t you? Come on, we all do it. Just admit it.

“I find your three quotes from my Rutgers post quite interesting”

I find your lack of faith . . . disturbing.

“I am proud of the bike because MY FRIENDS AND I BUILT IT.”

Sweet, my mom was proud of me when I first learned how not to piss myself. I’ll go blog about it.

“You call that pretentious and elitist?”

Yes.

“The second quote, touche. I agree, that statement definitely compares myself to others and I purport to be the strongest. Well, you know what? Strongest does not mean fastest or the winner. Strongest means I had a ton of training with no anaerobic top-end, as well as being so marked by the field that “FREY!” was yelled every time I attacked. Sorry for being *slightly* frustrated at such negative racing, as well as describing the first test of the season in which I obviously didn’t win and was trying to both make myself feel better about it as well as learn from it and move forward.”

Ben Showman was pretty strong. Pretty DAMN strong. Are you sure you were the strongest? Who do you think everyone watched for in this year’s edition of Paris-Roubaix? I’m not sure that engineering background to which you later allude will help you out with this one so I’ll give you a hint — his name starts with “T” and ends with “om Boonen”. Ok, maybe that wasn’t fair, I’ll bet Fabian Cancellara thought he was the strongest because he had a ton of training with no anaerobic top-end. Strongest, eh? You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means.

“The third quote, about bamboo naturally being optimized, IS TRUE. I am sorry that you do not understand how bamboo “grows more bamboo” . . . it does so by not being knocked down by the wind, by growing quickly and spreading quickly and maximizing its height in order to rise above other brush and get sunlight. Wind’s forces cause it to naturally optimize its cross-sectional shape and move its high-tensile-strength lignin fibers to the perimeter of the shaft for maximum second moment of inertia, a basic principle you would have learned in solid mechanics if you had any type of an engineering background. A bike frame requires stiff, light tubes–bamboo doesn’t give a shit if it will be made into a bike frame, and it has not evolved specifically for that purpose, but that doesn’t mean a creative group of engineers can’t make use of it in that capacity.”

Natural selection is a basic principle you would have learned in evolutionary theory if you had any type of a biology background. I often shit some very stiff, light tubes — should I try to make a bike frame out of that? I’ll bet I could get a creative group of fecalphiliacs to make use of it in some capacity or another.

“Finally, in response to one of the comments, yes I race for Time Pro Cycling, and yes I am sponsored by Time and part of my obligations is to promote their brand. However, in collegiate cycling, I am not racing for Time, and it is obviously not on the same level as an NRC race that may be shown in VeloNews or on cyclingnews.com. Erik Saunders has since asked me to just ride the Time, but at that point in the season in a collegiate race, it was fine to ride a homemade bamboo bike.”

“I would just like to say that I am an honest, good guy and I only wish to encourage other potential cyclists to discover the sport that is my life’s passion. I think it is ridiculous that you stand up and criticize all “fast” riders as being self-centered and pretentious . . . this sport requires you to be self-centered to succeed, but what pursuit in life does not require that as you get the the highest levels?”

So what are you saying here? That you are, in fact, self-centered and pretentious because, let’s be honest, you are at the highest level (give or take)? Why take offense to being called the same, then? I don’t bitch and moan when people call me an asshole.

“Even doctors are incredibly self-centered in general, but I do not hear you criticizing them and their actions”

Well you never criticized communists or terrorists or murderers or their actions on your blog! Why do you hate America? I guess that any type of an engineering background doesn’t cover logical fallacies, does it?

“Show some intelligence and some maturity in your opinions, and maybe you will no longer be one of those cyclists who just rants and complains about their sport and the people in it.”

The opinion was pretty well fleshed out and supported with initial premise stated, multiple examples cited as well as conclusions drawn and further steps suggested. Didn’t your class on maximum second moment of inertia in solid mechanics teach you to form and support a coherent argument?

Like I said before, I haven’t had this much fun in an internet flamewar since the ol’ LKML microkernel debate of aught four (only half-joking here). Come on Nick, join the dark side (like I already have) and just admit you’re better than everyone else (except me). Or take the guilty way out and say, “meh, you’re right wcuk, I could stand to be a bit more humble, although I still think my bamboo bike is pretty sweet.”

Love for always and for ever and always,
theJenksster

p.s. if the italics don’t format the quotes right, it’s not my fault. Blame wcuk for not having a preview button!

I find your three quotes from my Rutgers post quite interesting–the first is meant to elaborate on how many people were asking me about the bike and how much interest it generated. Obviously I can warm up and talk at the same time, sorry for EXAGGERATING. I am proud of the bike because MY FRIENDS AND I BUILT IT. We didn’t go out and drop $2695 for a Bamboo Calfee, we freaking went to the river and cut down bamboo and tested and tried and built it. You call that pretentious and elitist?

The second quote, touche. I agree, that statement definitely compares myself to others and I purport to be the strongest. Well, you know what? Strongest does not mean fastest or the winner. Strongest means I had a ton of training with no anaerobic top-end, as well as being so marked by the field that “FREY!” was yelled every time I attacked. Sorry for being *slightly* frustrated at such negative racing, as well as describing the first test of the season in which I obviously didn’t win and was trying to both make myself feel better about it as well as learn from it and move forward.

The third quote, about bamboo naturally being optimized, IS TRUE. I am sorry that you do not understand how bamboo “grows more bamboo” . . . it does so by not being knocked down by the wind, by growing quickly and spreading quickly and maximizing its height in order to rise above other brush and get sunlight. Wind’s forces cause it to naturally optimize its cross-sectional shape and move its high-tensile-strength lignin fibers to the perimeter of the shaft for maximum second moment of inertia, a basic principle you would have learned in solid mechanics if you had any type of an engineering background. A bike frame requires stiff, light tubes–bamboo doesn’t give a shit if it will be made into a bike frame, and it has not evolved specifically for that purpose, but that doesn’t mean a creative group of engineers can’t make use of it in that capacity.

Finally, in response to one of the comments, yes I race for Time Pro Cycling, and yes I am sponsored by Time and part of my obligations is to promote their brand. However, in collegiate cycling, I am not racing for Time, and it is obviously not on the same level as an NRC race that may be shown in VeloNews or on cyclingnews.com. Erik Saunders has since asked me to just ride the Time, but at that point in the season in a collegiate race, it was fine to ride a homemade bamboo bike.

I would just like to say that I am an honest, good guy and I only wish to encourage other potential cyclists to discover the sport that is my life’s passion. I think it is ridiculous that you stand up and criticize all “fast” riders as being self-centered and pretentious . . . this sport requires you to be self-centered to succeed, but what pursuit in life does not require that as you get the the highest levels? Even doctors are incredibly self-centered in general, but I do not hear you criticizing them and their actions. Show some intelligence and some maturity in your opinions, and maybe you will no longer be one of those cyclists who just rants and complains about their sport and the people in it.

Now that I’ve made my own ad hominem attack, let the record show that I myself am one of those “upper-tier racers” who has no humility. Sometimes it’s for real, sometimes it’s for kicks but one thing I sure can tell you is there are far more “me’s” out here on the Right Coast than there are “Travis Browns”. Perhaps it’s a function of geographical attitude, as I’ve heard secondhand that, out in the West, “it’s all about riding the bike, maaaan.”

love forever,
the “34×18? you must be some kind of superhuman” Jenksster

p.s. man i love teh internets . . . i haven’t participated in a flamewar like this since the infamous LKML microkernal debate of ‘aught four!

The lady doth protest too much. OK, lets peel the onion here. 1) the author does use a broad brush to paint all cyclists in the light he has chosen, you conveniently left out the second half of the quote above, “I am usually left with the same reoccurring question at the end of the day. Do these guys care about anyone but themselves?” Ergo – “What is it about bike racing that breeds selfishness?” Bike racing doesn’t breed selfishness nor more than listening to Rock N’ Roll breeds juvenile delinquency. My reference to Travis was one made to someone you might recognize, I could have easily have fired off a laundry list of top riders in Colorado you would have no reference to. Most of the people I know who race, started with a passion for the sport, and took it from there, and further more these people, even those with ‘real’ day jobs realize their own fortune. My point is that bike racing is not the issue here, the author and his circle of friends and acquaintances are at the core of the issue here.

I am not saying there are not assholes and self-serving riders in our ranks, I just see them as the exception, not the rule.

2) I never said that sacrifice leads to arrogance, it can be misinterpreted that way, though I don’t see that is the case with the examples listed by the author. I was mearly making that point because I have seen that misunderstanding before between riders, but knowing better of both parties.

3) As per you final request- to quote Seinfeld- “No thanks, I have enough friends.”

will is too nice to respond (or too lazy), but i’m appalled enough by your comment to respond myself.

first of all, the broad brush:
you accuse him of grouping cyclists together and “skewering” them (insert QR joke here), and in doing so, painting guys like Brown with the same broad brushstroke. so, what, he can’t comment on the jerks without calling all cyclists jerks? does he not concede early on that he’s met “many amazing, interesting, humble riders?” i submit that the only way to interpret this post as an overgeneralization is to have ignored what the author actually wrote.

the non sequitor:
how does arrogance follow from sacrifice? sure, healthy living, social life of a monk, blah blah great. how does that lead to selfishness? which brings me to my next point: fender stratocasters are better than any gibson ever made. you should buy a stratocaster. it would make you a better guitarist.

last but not least, the ad hominem attack:
“Quit being so quick to label and shun other different you and practice tolerance… it will make you that nice cyclist that you seem to be seeking”
wow. wow. you must be fun to hang out with. will you be my friend?

s.

But true, the phenomenon does seem particularly true of cyclists. I half wonder if it’s high price of bikes and bike clothing that breeds the snobby, materialistic elitism.

http://bikesnobnyc.blogspot.com/2008/02/fixedgeargalleryof-pop-quizzes.html